Size difference between female and male smallmouth?

[taxid]

It's a given that female largemouth tend to be larger than males of the same age.  Has anyone observed this to be true of smallmouth bass that they've seen on a bed or caught? As in a gravid female is significantly larger than the male on the nest? I've seen some literature that says they are similar in size vs. largemouth bass, but I don't believe everything I read, and I've only seen this mentioned once.

Why am I asking this? I run a small fish farm and I'm in the process of moving several smallmouth from my main pond to a hatchery pond where I will have beds set up for them to do their thing and hopefully produce smallmouth bass fry. My problem is I'm moving fish that are large but not obviously gravid. It may just be a little early for them to look busting with eggs, but then again my smallmouth are pellet trained and fed so they tend to be robust so it's kind of hard to tell at this point.


It appears I have two groups of bass I am catching. One big and beefy and the other much smaller. I'm hoping this is female vs. male similar to the situation with largemouths. But I would like those of you that have a lot of experience with smallmouth let me know if that is what you have observed.

If you're interested here's the pond with the beds

~1/10 acre pond for smallmouth production. (About 90 X 40 X 28)




Limestone boulders on one side originally in place to prevent erosion.





Limestone boulders that are under water that create natural pockets to be partially filled in with landscaping size stone and cobble stone this weekend. I'll space the beds about 20 feet apart with some shallow and some deep depending on what they prefer.




One of three chunky smalmouth from 14 to 16 inches moved to the pond today from the main pond. More to move in the next few days. The fish is chunky but does not really have an extended abdomen.



Sorry about the lack of quality in the picture but as we all know it's tough to take a picture of a fish while you're holding it!


O.K. lets hear if from the experts!

[monkeyman2269]

No idea but thats awsome why smallys and what do u do with them

[taxid]

No idea but thats awsome why smallys and what do u do with them

It's my first time to attempt to spawn smallies. The broodfish originally came from a supplier in Michigan as fingerlings.

[monkeyman2269]

If u suceed what u gonna do with all of them

[taxid]

If u suceed what u gonna do with all of them

I hatch and produce fish primarily for my own use so I don't have to buy them from suppliers for my niche market. My niche market is supplying trophy size frozen fish for other taxidermists. I used to also supply fish for Bass Pro Shops but they claim their big musky and pike are eating them. I think they found a cheaper supplier or they're cutting expenses.  

I do have extra live fish from time to time and usually sell them locally. Shipping fish out of state requires expensive health testing. I rarely do it.

[Goatskin]

Thats pretty cool set up you have. As for the size difference Ive never really heard anything about male and female smallies being bigger or smaller.

[teampar]

That is a really cool set up!

[bigredfishing]

I've never actually spawned smallmouth, but I sure have plucked a few off beds .   It seems to me that pretty much every bed that had two fish, had one thats thick/chunky/bigger and a smaller somewhat skinnier fish, and always assumed it was female vs. male.    I know that during some springs,  for about 5 days you can only catch small skinny smallmouth in the rivers around here and again, i always assumed they were males.

[taxid]

I've never actually spawned smallmouth, but I sure have plucked a few off beds .   It seems to me that pretty much every bed that had two fish, had one thats thick/chunky/bigger and a smaller somewhat skinnier fish, and always assumed it was female vs. male.    I know that during some springs,  for about 5 days you can only catch small skinny smallmouth in the rivers around here and again, i always assumed they were males.

I'm hoping that is the case as it would make it easy to pair up the fish in my small spawning pond. At least it seems to be something I've observed in largemouth bass.

I had  my vet do an ultrasound and an x-ray on some of my fish today. Not conclusive but we thought we may be able to see ovaries in the larger of the two fish.

Here they are in the process of being anesthesized in a five gallon bucket.



Here is portable ultrasound which was inconclusive.



Here's an x-ray of the largest fish



One of the smallmouth puked up a frog just before I released it into the spawning pond. That explains whey there are NO MORE FROGS in the pond with the smallmouth.   

[bigredfishing]

that x-ray is REALLY cool!!    How much did the vet charge for using the ultra sound and the xray?   Do you use clove oil to anaesthetise your fish or the old MS-222?

[taxid]

that x-ray is REALLY cool!!    How much did the vet charge for using the ultra sound and the xray?   Do you use clove oil to anaesthetise your fish or the old MS-222?

Only $35.00 for both x-rays and the ultrasound.

I used something similar to the MS222 called Tricane I believe.

[Fat Boy]

Well, just observe them.  Males tend to flick through the channels with their remote as the females complain, whereas females tend to stick to watching one channel...

...OK, that was bad.  Seriously, here's that I found on a quick search that seems to make sense...maybe give it a try:
http://www.ehow.com/how_5844107_tell-male-bass-female-bass.html

Nice set up you have there.  What a cool thing to do!

[taxid]

Update!

I have a few hundred to a thousand smallmouth fry in the pond!

The black fry in the picture are smallmouth bass.  Smallmouth bass fry are black initially according to the literature I have read. They are not tadpoles as I have those too, but they look much different and swim differently.



I quickly removed the broodfish as they seemed to be taking an interest in the free swimming fry!

[monkeyman2269]

How u get the parents

[taxid]

How u get the parents

See reply number 2.