Massachusetts pond formed by an earthquake?

[taxid]

According to the book Weird Massachusetts many years ago a Native American from the area said this pond in Massachusetts was formed by a massive earthquake about 100 years before the White settlers showed up. He claimed the pond was originally a hill that collapsed upon itself.

All evidence seems to indicate it is of glacial origin (glacial kettle lake) but could that be wrong?

.  (Photo by Satish Sharma)

This is "Mirror Lake" at Devens originally Hell Pond. The Military renamed it the generic Mirror Lake with the original Native American name Shibokin (means hell in Native American).

Conjecture is it was named Hell Pond due to it's great depth for it's surface area, but perhaps hell could be more related to it's origin as in an earthquake from the bowels of the earth. 

Tried to find record of an earthquake in the 1500's but they only go back to the 1600's of which there was at least one big one. Maybe there is geological evidence if there is remotely a chance of this Indian legend being correct?

 

[Spider1]

I don't know, sounds a little suspect to me. As far as I know, before Europeans showed up, the Native Americans didn't have a word for hell and didn't even have a concept for it. It wasn't a part of their religious beliefs. The entire region was glacial and I personally would believe it would be a glacial lake but I guess it could happen.

[taxid]

I don't know, sounds a little suspect to me. As far as I know, before Europeans showed up, the Native Americans didn't have a word for hell and didn't even have a concept for it. It wasn't a part of their religious beliefs. The entire region was glacial and I personally would believe it would be a glacial lake but I guess it could happen.

Couldn't a language that is only oral and pictorial still have spoken words that can be written in English the way they sound? This seems to be the case.

https://i.imgur.com/c0oDGEm.png

I don't know enough about Native Americans to know if they had a concept for hell. I do know they had spiritual beliefs. Perhaps it was just a physical description as in deep in the earth related to tectonic activity?



 

[SalmonAndStriper Stalker]

do they stock that place with trout? its not on the stocking list

[SalmonAndStriper Stalker]

nevermind i stand corrected they do. i finally found it on the stocking list

[taxid]

It is stocked but all but ignored since it's on federal property. I saw a guy release a 3 pound brook trout trolling with lead core line last summer. A friend from Ayer caught a 6 pound holdover brown in there several years back. It hasn't even been surveyed since the 1950's. After the 23d of June you have to use a purchased seasonal pass or pay each time you launch. Lots of restrictions but it's a neat little pond. Has a nice little beach. I have never seen water as clear as on this pond. Water clarity has to be at least 25 feet. It's about 60 feet deep which is quite deep for a 35 acre pond.

Here's a response I got from a Prof at Boston College --when I queried whether it's remotely possible it's present state is due to an earthquake -- about 100 years before the European settlers showed up according to one Native American: 

Cecil,
Thank you for the email.  I have read several items describing native American legends about earthquakes, but this is the first that I have heard of this one.

There are several reasons to take this legend seriously.  First, an earthquake like this could well have taken place in the region.  Perhaps not quite the way the native American legends report it, but it is quite possible that an earthquake strong enough to affect a lake at Devens took place within a century before Europeans came to America.

Second, there was a good sized earthquake in 1638 that was felt strongly by the colonists of New England.  When Roger Williams in Rhode Island talked to the native Americans after that earthquake, he was told that there had been four similar earlier events during the 80 or so years prior to the coming of the Europeans to North America.  Perhaps the event that affected Shibokin was one of those and the timing in the legends is a little off.

Third, there is regular small earthquake activity in the Littleton, MA area, and Shibokin is in that vicinity.  I think the modern small earthquakes could be aftershocks of a strong earthquake that took place some time ago (i.e., probably hundreds of years ago) at or near Littleton.

Finally, we know that lakes can be affected by strong earthquakes.  There was a study by Prof. Katrin Monecke at Wellesley College and others (including myself) that came out earlier this year that found evidence for the 1755 earthquake in the sediments of Sluice Pond in Lynn, MA.  In the future perhaps Mirror Lake could be one of the targets of study by this research team.

With regards,
John Ebel

I see there was a tremor in Harvard (the town not the university) 6 months ago according to the USGS. That's pretty much right next to the pond.

Another picture by Satish Sharma from this spring: Don't be fooled by the shallow water next to the boat ramp. It drops of precipitously over most of the lake. Would be a great pond to scuba dive in if you can get permission. No cottages either! Completely undeveloped except for a small swimming beach.

[Knot there yet]

I’d love to hear more about Sluice Pond study. Could you share a link?

[Spider1]

well there ya go. It would be really cool if the area was studied and the stories of the native Americans were substantiated all because you asked a question. Very cool.

[taxid]

I’d love to hear more about Sluice Pond study. Could you share a link?

Here ya go:

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/03/27/researchers-find-evidence-earthquake-bottom-lynn-pond/DMKUkk6z4htIpe4uDb4ZsO/story.html

[taxid]

well there ya go. It would be really cool if the area was studied and the stories of the native Americans were substantiated all because you asked a question. Very cool.

Yup.

This will sound corny but I feel like this pond was important to the Native Americans for some reason. And I am not alone. The hills around it give it a kind of amphitheater look and it's very tranquil.

[lowaccord66]

Yup.

This will sound corny but I feel like this pond was important to the Native Americans for some reason. And I am not alone. The hills around it give it a kind of amphitheater look and it's very tranquil.

Not corny to me.  Have Native American heritage in my family.  Im sure others do as well. 

[taxid]

Not corny to me.  Have Native American heritage in my family.  Im sure others do as well.

Awesome! I am fascinated by anything Native American. I think it would be amazing to be able to travel back in time before the European settlers showed up and our natural resources were abysmally raped and exploited. It would be fascinating to be an invisible observer.

I'm not naive enough to believe the Native Americans were saints, but the landscape must have looked a lot different!

[taxid]

I may have posted these pictures before and if I did I apologize.  This is what the pond looked like around 1911 before the military took the property over. No that much different than now. An old timer quite a few years back told me one had to hike in and he came in on his dads shoulders. Said the water was at least 10 feet deeper and you could jump into the water from the top of the hill between the boat launch and what is now the swimming beach. (Courtesy of Mass Fish & Wildlife)

[taxid]

Not corny to me.  Have Native American heritage in my family.  Im sure others do as well.

Would be only right to change the name back to the original Native American name of Shobokin Pond wouldn't it? For the military to change the name to the cliche name of Mirror Like shows a special kind of arrogance. I'm guessing Hell Pond just didn't seem politically correct or proper.

[lowaccord66]

The origional name is definetly more meaningful than mirror lake.