ANY THOUGHTS ?

[Spitfire]

  What are your thoughts on Lakes that are closed to Smelting &  or Closed to ICE FISHING?........Does any one feel that it is good for the fishing, OR is it just the State, taking away more rights & access .......One lake comes to mind w/ me from years ago in the 60's. (PORTER LAKE in NEW VINEYARD)Was EXCEPTINALLY GOOD !!!-----Was closed to ice fishing for years & then they openened it & the Fishery went to h%ll in a hurry (Have no clue what it's like now?).........I've seen some Lakes & Pds in recent Winters that I personnally think are being over harvested for SMELTS. Hear that a lot of these smelts are taken out of State/ But don't know if that is a fact or even legal?.........Lake Auburn & Richarson I hear are doing very well......Anyone have thoughts or examples/ one way or the other??........... Lou

[knurren]

In NH, trout ponds are closed to ice fishing.  There are some places here that have no closed season, but few compared to the amount of places that hold trout that are closed.  I think it is necessary, I couldn't imagine how much more money it would cost to stock trout ponds for ice fishing as well as the regular open water season.  Don't get me wrong, there are places that would be perfect for ice fishing that I'd love to drill some holes in, but I know what would happen if the masses arrived.

[barkspud]

Well Lou that's a good one to get the old wheels turning. Id have to say that closing some lakes to the taking of smelts are good. Smelts are a delicate fish and with over harvesting (have seen it several time 5 gal. Buckets) hurt some places. Was a small brook that ran into a pond in Lincoln. The brook was restricted to kids 16 and under as kids we lived on that lake and brook every day. The smelts ran up it thick and just a few of us knew about it. Well the word got out after 5 or 6 years. Then adults started and lots taking over their limits wardens got some. Some bait dealers started put huge traps in lake at mouth of brook. The smelts didn't last many more years. One of us kids big mouths killed it. So mabey closing it might bring them back. Spring condition must play a big part too as so did over stocking. As far as closed to ice fishing lots of places need it good break. Stalk a pond in late fall and close to ice fishing gives the fish time to adapt and spread out. Hopfully grow a little too for spring. Ice fishing is hard on a small pond and don't see how some lakes take it. Glad every body isn't as good at catching fish as some of these guy's. I don't think the state is doing it just because they can I feel they are doing a good job but as everything could be a lot better. Just some thoughts                                                   Barkspud

[Kennebago Kid]

I am 100% in favor of closing some lakes to smelting and ice fishing. I think both can do signficant damage to certain fisheries. Think about ice fishing for a minute (and I ice fish, so this isn't an attack), when else can you have five live baits dangling out there (with sometimes dozens and dozens of fishermen) on a lake? How can this not impact a fishery if the lake isn't big enough to handle it, or has a delicate fishery?  There are plenty of places to ice fish, so no need to go after trophy open water lakes and ponds IMHO. On the smelting front, many will argue that smelting doesn't do any damage, but I would tend to disagree. Open to opinions as always, just my two cents. I can't imagine a fishery like Rangeley or Mooselook with ice fishing allowed. 

Porter Lake has fished pretty good for the last couple of years, at least on the ice, so that may buck my theory.

[lv2huntandfish]

Ponds that are closed to ice fishing in my opinion generally have a better quality fish. The place i was fishing earlyier in the spring was awesome becasue the trout had been stocked in the fall then they had all that time to be acclimated with the water. It also helps the fish spread out more and so places dont get fished out as quick. I love fishing those waters! just my .02

[Loves To Fish]

Lou, Lou, Lou,
                       Now you've done it, got me to express my opinion again.
This is my take on these 2 subjects:
        Every place that the MIF@W closes to ice fishing, the fishing / fisheries improves, especially if it's a small body of water. Why shouldn't it. You've eliminated a season that has high mortality's associated with released fish, plus all the other fish that people would be taking home to eat. Most fish are either flashed frozen or deeply hooked, two bad scenarios for the fish. And I love to ice fish, but until the state implements mandatory circle hook regulations and mandatory no removing fish from the water (if you plan to release the fish), then we will see even more ponds, in the future, closed to ice fishing.
        Smelts are a very controversial subject also. Smelters / fishermen want to get them to sell / eat / or even use for bait when fishing. Conservationists want people to leave them alone. I've heard many different opinions about smelts. I guess one more can't hurt.
Every place MIF@W closes to smelting, the fishing doesn't improve and in some cases it gets worse. Some places the fishing stays the same. Smelts only have a 5 or 6 year life cycle. If dipping is allowed, you are culling the population enough for next year's off-springs to have food to survive. Without removing some smelts each year, smelt populations overpopulate and crash; and so does the fishery. Kingsbury Pond is an excellent example of a superb smelt run year after year. And they have allowed dipping every year for decades.

[smeltslayer]

Here are a few thoughts on these subjects. First off Porter Lake I a have fished since I could walk. I don't care what pond you are on it has its up and downs. One of the worst things to happen to Porter Lake was the stopping of dipping smelts. This was not done for lack of but more for the trouble that smelting brought to the pond. Aka  drunks,fights and littering. The next bad thing was the illegal introduction of smallmouth bass. This lake fished real well with a great balance of bait and this was done by the harvesting of smelt in the spring. The spawners. Fish grow a lot better on small smelts as they are easier to digest than larger smelts. Once the dipping stops the lake get over populated with smelts and the fish have a buffet anywhere they go so they have no need for what your throwing at them.(Persay) Then once these smelt levels reach max level disease's can grow rapidly and affect all the smelts. Hence the large die off like the one that affected Rangeley a few years ago. ( Gonna happen again if the bio's don't pay attention). Then once the smelts die your fishing crashes they lose a bunch of weight and turn to stick fish. So it it is a complicated situation. There are a lot of waters in my eyes that should be open to ice fishing to control the fish and a few that should be closed. One that should be open is Mooselookmaguntic to help control the short salmon and aid in removing them from the water shed. Put a few of those lake up there on a rotaring list. Richarson, Azchicahoos have the three open once every three years. I think would do the fishery great for the salmon. Leave the brook trout( Not to be removed from the water) alone and you would see a great salmon fishing again. Fish with some weight. Here a prime example of two ponds that closed down there pond to taking smelts and the smelts have crashed and so have the fish or is about to. Spring Lake and Lake Auburn (Spring stocking was cancelled due to lack of smelts). Theres a fine line and you need a smart head to run these fisheries and I do not feel we have this right at this point in time. My Opinion only. Could go on about other ponds that have seen fishing decline since the stopage of taking smelts but will stop here. AND yes the state does take a lot of smelts from some waters to put in others and have seen the state mess up a few pond from overharvesting the smelt in one to put in another. 

[jrelaxin]

Thoughts are good by arguing with a couple of the best smelters in the region...just might be like tryin to dip on the wrong tide..........

[emeraldshiner]

I definately like smeltslayers idea about rotating ice fishing every three years for salmon only on Mooseleukmeguntic, Richardson and Aziscohos to thin out the short overpopulated salmon but I seriously doubt you will ever see it happen, longstanding tradition of closed waters to ice fishing in Rangeley region would be hard to overcome.

[smeltslayer]

I definitely like smeltslayers idea about rotating ice fishing every three years for salmon only on Mooseleukmeguntic, Richardson and Aziscohos to thin out the short overpopulated salmon but I seriously doubt you will ever see it happen, longstanding tradition of closed waters to ice fishing in Rangeley region would be hard to overcome.

I'm glad you agree with me emerald. These bios are going to have to some day manage these waters for what in them (fish) instead of what comes to them (flatlanders with all kinds of money). The business's up there would love to see some ice fishing opened up there to get some of these short salmon cleaned out. If we were to start a petition it might just turn into reality. I  know a couple of guides who said they would be for it as long as the ponds were rotated. Going to do a little leg work over the summer to see what I can get started! Business's would love the extra income that ice fisherman would bring. Gonna work on that uphill battle.  Would love to see it happen.

[emeraldshiner]

ATTA BOY Smeltslayer: Just like some of the old "blue laws" in Maine like no sunday hunting, we need some changes to old ways that no longer serve the resource or the local economy, just because this is the way we have always done this is no argument to continue doing it if we know it could be managed in a more intelligent way to maximize economic reward while enhancing the fishery!

[Spitfire]

   Will, when I said that Porter Lake was Exceptional; I meant that double digit Togue & 6-7-& 8lb. Salmon were produced on a regular basis in the 60's.......You say lakes have up & downs; Are you telling me that you have seen this kind of fishing @ Porter since the early 70's?.......I remember, we would leave Lewiston About 5am & go to Porter Lake (Catch a limit & be back in Town by 10 or 11am)------Limit used to be 7.5lbs.-- Many times there would be @  least 1  10+ Togue in the limit. .....Haven't seen or heard of people doing that too consistently anymore.......Am I wrong?........Lou

[smeltslayer]

You can thank the invasive species for the decline of the fisheries. Yellow perch,pickeral,white perch and now sm bass. My boy got a 28"  8.5 lb togue out of there a couple years ago. We just dont fish it enough be cause the togue taste like mud out of Porter. There are some big fish still in there just got to put your time in. Seen a couple 4 lb salmon, and a bunch of brood stock 4+ lb brookies in the last few years hold over very well.

[Spitfire]

You can thank the invasive species for the decline of the fisheries. Yellow perch,pickeral,white perch and now sm bass. My boy got a 28"  8.5 lb togue out of there a couple years ago. We just dont fish it enough be cause the togue taste like mud out of Porter. There are some big fish still in there just got to put your time in. Seen a couple 4 lb salmon, and a bunch of brood stock 4+ lb brookies in the last few years hold over very well.

   I noticed a major decline in the fishing, in the early 70's right after I got out of the service.( also was right after the lake was opened to ICE FISHING. Had heard that people were catching brookies & rainbows. that the State had introduced into Porter, around the same period. Hadn't heard about the perch nor  any Smallies during that same period.  As a matter of fact, I didn't even know that they were in there, T'll you just mentioned it......... 1 thing is for sure:--- I haven't seen any post of quality fish on a regular basis; Like I remember, from The Early 60's........It seems that too many folks are blaming it on Smallies & Pike & Perch  etc.......This is only MY OPINION, but I believe that ice fishing & Raping our lakes of bait fish is playing a much BIGGER ROLE in the problem........ And I would like to add that; I'm not surprised that more trout & Salmon fisherman have not replied to this post....... Many are quick to reply when it's about Invasives & Rubber worms; But seem to shy away when it is about a  STAND that could limit their fishing......... I would love to hear from more fisherman on this subject. Seems that most people are willing to throw the other fisherman under the bus; That's OK, As long as we don't mess w/ their little species. I find it hard to believe that I would be alone on the feeling that these two issues might be the cause (or, a CAUSE) of the decline of quality & numbers of Salmon & Trout??........Thank you to those that have responded. ( good imput)........Lou