Portable downrigger

[Seahunt]

good points all around. I am pretty d**n good with angles I'll post my GRE results lol.

I thought I remember seeing a chart that estimates true depth based on angle, speed, and size of weight. could be wrong. I'll just use my 4 pounder  for the salmon still at 30'

Not sure about the chart?
Think you'll find that speed, weight and resistance/drag against ball, think flashers, current, etc..) determine the blow back angle.
Good luck, regardless. 

[Mac Attack]

Won't be much blow back, and up, if the ball is only 30' down.

[Seahunt]

Won't be much blow back, and up, if the ball is only 30' down.

Mac, usually you and I are on the same page.  

I've only used a 4# ball on a rigger rowing a canoe around 1.2-1.4 sog.
Many years ago I tried some 6# balls down to 30'. I quickly went to 8# +.
That being said, I almost always have both vertical and horizontal flashers on the bigger boats. Adds a lot of resistance.

I respect how you great lake guys fish and follow suit when on Lake O.
In a lot of ways, we fish different than you guys. Some of it's a regional thing. Some of it's due to our bait fish and smaller tail fins on the predators.
One example is NH does not allow cheaters.

Porkiepiehat  is reportedly good on angles.  
Maybe he'll share the angle of his cable with a 4# ball down 30' at 2+ mph sog?
If he gives me an exact angle and measure of cable out, I'll do the math.  

[Mac Attack]

Mac, usually you and I are on the same page.  

I've only used a 4# ball on a rigger rowing a canoe around 1.2-1.4 sog.
Many years ago I tried some 6# balls down to 30'. I quickly went to 8# +.
That being said, I almost always have both vertical and horizontal flashers on the bigger boats. Adds a lot of resistance.

I'm with you.
Never will use less than 8#
And won't go more than that when using a manual for obvious reasons.   

But he said he had 4# and only went 30' deep at most.

Let's say his angle is 30 degrees.
His blow back at 30' of cable out is like 14' but more importantly, his ball is now only about 20' down.
Big deal here is approximating the angle of the cable when it blows back.
With only 4# the blow back will be more than with a 10# weight of course.
And speed plays a factor as well as the other things you mentioned (added resistance).

Here's some info -

http://www.lakemichiganangler.com/tips/downrigger_depth.htm


And Cannon has some blowback charts in this manual -

http://store.cannondownriggers.com/media/document/3397130MagnumWEB.pdf

[dickbaker]

   Ok!  you fellows have over thought this blow back way too much.   After 20 years of dragging 4lb to 6 lb. rigger balls I've found that @ mph trolling speed  the concept of a 30 degree blow back is excessive?   With 40 years experience as a land surveyor I've always been able to guestimate the angle of the cable and estimate actual ball depth even pulling 4 ft. of Dave Davis spinners?   I will have to admit that I will never drag bottom for lakers or eyes in 100 feet of water.   Once the thermocline drops below 50 feet I'm off to shore casting for bass and pike or walleye in the Conn. river with water no deeper than 40 ft.   Horizontal flashers , at the ball, will bring fish up a long way so 5 ft. more or less isn't  important as long as you think your above the marked fish?   
But!  a big advantage of a heavy rigger ball is  a better hook set because the release is connected to a heavier mass!   
Now!  If someone could provide a 6 lb. pancake ball I would argue that all of you are wrong?
Dick

[dickbaker]

    I can't believe I actually  disagreed with Attack??  He has always seemed my Jeti Master!
Dick

[Mac Attack]

Dick
My numbers were fine
And I almost posted this earlier

I believe that a 30 degree blow back is inreal.

This, changes everything.

Lol

In the end, drop the ball and bait
Experiment at different depths
When you start catching fish at a specific depth......repeat what you were doing, where you were doing it.

[lowaccord66]

Just a thought but rather than try to calc blowback would it not be easier to up the gain on the finder to see exactly where the ball is?  Might not work for everyone depending on setups but seems logical. 

[Hottuna5150]

Iowaaccord66, that is exactly what I've done to find depth. With my mini I wouldn't trust the arm to handle much more than a 4lb ball. Even with 30 (ish) degree blowback I can usually see my ball as deep as 70 ft at 2+mph with my gain on high. Often I can even see the bait show just slightly below the ball.

[Mac Attack]

Just a thought but rather than try to calc blowback would it not be easier to up the gain on the finder to see exactly where the ball is?  Might not work for everyone depending on setups but seems logical. 

As things move out from directly below the transducer, like fish on the edge of the cone, they are shown deeper than they actually are.
Same thing would happen with a ball.
Now......lets' say you got 30' of cable out, and the blowback angle is 30 degrees, and the ball is actually down 20', will the depthfinder show it as 30' down???


Hmmmmm...............................more fodder.

 

[Seahunt]

Dick
My numbers were fine
And I almost posted this earlier

I believe that a 30 degree blow back is inreal.

This, changes everything.

Lol

In the end, drop the ball and bait
Experiment at different depths
When you start catching fish at a specific depth......repeat what you were doing, where you were doing it.

Exactly, Mac.

Iowaaccord66, that is exactly what I've done to find depth. With my mini I wouldn't trust the arm to handle much more than a 4lb ball. Even with 30 (ish) degree blowback I can usually see my ball as deep as 70 ft at 2+mph with my gain on high. Often I can even see the bait show just slightly below the ball.

4# ball, 70' deep, trolling 2+ SOG, 30'ish degree angle? SMH. 

[Mac Attack]

4# ball, 70' deep, trolling 2+ SOG, 30'ish degree angle? SMH. 

Would need a cone angle of at least 60 degrees.

Nope!

[lowaccord66]

Ah we are now getting in the weeds.  Dont forget Mac if you have humminbird 360 scan or Garmin Panoptics there would be little chance of not marking the ball.

[Hottuna5150]

Considering my transducer is directly in line with my downrigger (I have it suction cupped to the bottom of my canoe) it would not require 60 degrees it would require a maximum of 30 if I had gotten out my protractor and actually measured the cable angle rather than just thrown out a ballpark figure. Ill get an exact figure next time

[dickbaker]

Anybody ever try the portable ones that clamp on to the side wall of a 14 ft aluminum I'm looking at the Scotty one and what size weight thanks

Back to the original thread?   The 14 ft starcraft is a nice boat.  I would hate to mangle its gunnel with a clam on rigger??  Most important information is whether you will be trolling below 50 ft. very often?  When I'm fishing solo I prefer to drag two lead core rigs rather than playing with my down riggers!  The concept of bouncing bottom with a 8lb+ ball in 100 feet of water seems like a big gunnel risk if you get hung up??

Dick