Standard or Large Arbor

[livin4ice]

Cider brought up an interesting point today in one of his posts today.  So now I am curious to know what people think about the movement toward large arbor reels.  I am strongly considering going to the large arbor.  Who has already done this and who is considering it?

[Trevor]

Doesn't tweak my interest too much.  I always fill the spool to full capacity with backing anyway, before adding the line.   Was pretty common practise growing up as we mainly fished Atlantic Salmon.  Doesn't take long for one of those suckers to run you out of line if you don't have adequate backing.  Perhaps if someone can provide some insight as to the advantages I might consider one...

Trevor

[tommyboy]

I bought my first large arbor last year, and I will never go back to the "standard" design.  Supposedly, they offer a whole slew of advantages, but I am only concerned with a couple.  First,  since the spool is so much larger, it is much easier to palm the spool while a fish is on a run, mainly because the spoll will be spinning much slower rpm (I tend to set the drag light because I prefer to "feel" the run).  Second, after the run is over, I can pick up my line a lot quicker, which is especially helpful when the fish runs towards you.
They also claim that the drag is better on large arbor reels, but I am not totally convinced.  Don't get me wrong, the drag on my Loop Evotec LW is by far the smoothest that I have ever used, but I don't know if I can attribute it to the fact that it is a large arbor reel or a $500 reel (I managed to find a new one on Ebay for $300 less than that from a guy in Australia).
As for the concern of not having enough backing, my Loop is quite a bit wider than a standard reel to make up for the loss of having a larger diameter.
Also, here is a pretty good link with some more info on large arbor reels: http://www.flyrodreel.com/arborreels.html

[Trevor]

I'm confused Tommyboy.  You say"I can pick up my line a lot quicker, which is especially helpful when the fish runs towards you" 

Does a large arbor reel have a larger diameter spool than a standard design spooled full of backing?

Trevor

[tommyboy]

Trevor,

Not exactly.  A large arbor reel with all of the backing out has about the same diameter as a standard reel will all of the backing still on.
With this, if the first run is away, which takes all of your backing, and the second run is towards, you can pick up your slack backing very fast.  If the first run is towards, you can pick up the slack quicker in order to palm the reel on a second run away (which I prefer over relying solely on my drag).

Tom

[Cider]

It's like I mentioned over on the Fly Rod thread.  The large arbor reels allow you to pick up line faster due to the larger diameter.  Think of it in revolutions per minute or turning radius of the spool.  You don't have to turn the large arbor reel as far to take in the same amount of line as the conventional reel.  So even if you wind both reels at the same speed, you will retrieve the line with the larger arbor the fastest everytime.  This is why you fill the spool on a conventional reel with as much backing as possible before adding the line.  It allows you to take up the line much quicker because you have in a sense increased the diameter of your spool.

It is also thought that with the larger arbor spool, your line is less prone to memory and coiling issues while casting thus giving you better turn over and fly presentation.

These reels are all still new though in my opinion.  I think I need to be convinced a bit more yet.  At least the physics behind the reel make sense to me.

Does anyone know if they have the same line capacity as a conventional fly reel?

[Cider]

Tommyboy - just read the article you linked to in your post.  That was great.  It definitely did spell out that large arbor reels are subject to diminished capacity as I thought.  What I didn't realize is that they make these reels slightly wider to make up for the loss of line capacity.

Maybe I will have to give one a try.  I have been wanting a 8/9 wt rod for steelhead and large salmon.  Might be a good out-fit to try a large arbor reel on as these fish tend to be more aggressive and spool your reel more than smaller fish.  Would be a true test of the drag theories that article talks about.

[Trevor]

Cool, thanks for the clarification Tommy.  I might have to check em out.  My old man swears by them.  He's been using them for about three years now.  Won't use anything else.

Trevor

[livin4ice]

I think when it comes to the larger diameter it will depend on the brand and model you purchase.  I have seen some that look to me to be about the same diameter as a standard while others are obviously a larger diameter. Look at the large arbor reels on the Orvis site, they look to have different diameters.  http://www.orvis.com .  Anyway, I haven't done it yet but am still strongly considering it.

[Dark Cloud]

Cider - A good large arbor reel that wont cost an arm is the Okuma Integerty. I have two of the 8/9s and like em. They have wooped many large salmon and are through thier 2nd season. Two years ago I destroyed a reel costing twice as much in about 3 hours and a few dozen hook-ups. Plus a few other reels in less than a season....
Over all im not overly impressed with the "rage" of large arbor reels. They really dont hold that much more line. And im not worried about beeing spooled. When salmon fishing, if a fish gets more than 40-50 yards away, I break em off and tie on another fly and hook another one.
Bought a Pflueger Trion last year and its kind of an mid arbor style. Very happy with that reel...

[tommyboy]

Just wondering if you guys have any fly shops around you that let you try stuff out?  I know the guys at the lake placid fly shop that I posted on the other link were often very helpful and would allow people to try out some of there demo equipment.  That's probably a better option for you guys that are hesitant about large arbor reels, since most are quite a bit more expensive than standard reels, and they are not for everybody.

DC - I don't think line capacity is the point of the large arbor reel.  Mine holds about the same, maybe a little less, than a standard reel, but I can pick it up a lot faster, even when my backing is all out.  And I don't want to start anything, but I am curious as to why you break off your fish after a long run?  I've never heard of that before - maybe I'm doing something wrong.

[Cider]

Tommyboy - as far as I know, my fly shops don't allow you to demo equipment.  Sure would be nice though.  I think I will inquire to see what the response would be.  I don't see why they wouldn't have a couple of demo items that they can write off as a business expense if it is going to lead to increased sales.

[tommyboy]

Now that I think about it, they also gave fly fishing seminars at that shop too.  Maybe if you find a shop that does that, they will be more likely to have demo equipment.  Also, if you like it, you may be able to buy it at a greatly reduced price.

[Cider]

Our shop does offer casting and fishing lessons through the local college.  It is an Orvis shop so usually when you take the class, your fees cover the cost of a basic rod/reel package.

It is worth looking into though.  I never thought about asking if they demo equipment before.

[Dark Cloud]

TommyBoy - I hear ya on the line pick-up. I just havent noticed a big diff.
The fish "break off" is a Salmon river thing. A few reasons ~~ If the fish is that far away from ya up there it is probably foul hooked. The river gets so thick with fish at times its impossible to not foul hook alot. After a while you get so you cant tell how a fish is hooked. Legal(mouth) hooked fish are much easier to controll and you can feel the shake of the head.
Its very crowded at times there and if a fish takes off up or down stream you have two options, stand and fight it or chase it down. Standing and fighting it isnt an option for me cuz I dont want to prevent other people from fishing while I stand there like the statue of liberty. Chasing down a salmon isnt my ball of wax either. Falling on the rocks for a grungy salmon isnt worth it. And many times you have a great spot in the river and leaving it to fight a foul hooked fish is a pain. Others step into your spot and trying to squeeze back in isnt fun.
If a fish is legally hooked you rarely have to move more than 10-15 ft to land it depending on the current of course.
The Salmon riverand other Ontario tribs is the only place you see this "break em off" thing practiced. Probably due to the number of foul hooked fish. Many times other anglers see where the fish is hooked and yell to break em off, its foul hooked....