Is this a Bowfin?

[ChenBassHead]

Who are we to say which fish are "trash" and which fish are not?  The fact of the matter is that the bowfin isn't an introduced species; it's one of the originals.  The underwater ecosystems have evolved and developed around the presense of the bowfin.  So why do we now condemn it? Possibly because of the misconception that toothy fish automatically spell disaster for any fishery.  Pike/muskies in Maine (although I can see the point here, because these were introduced into trout/salmon waters), Alligator Gar in the south...and now bowfin?  Give me a break...I would love to see scientific proof that the presence of bowfin in a body of water has had a significant impact on the "glorified" species like bass, walleyes, perch, etc...Why should these fish be put on a higher pedistal than fish like bowfin and gar?  In my opinion, they shouldn't...ESPECIALLY by a depertment such as the DNR.  These "trash" fish should be praised for their fighting ability and for the unique opportunity they present to anglers...not killed for no good reason.  You can bet that every bowfin I catch will be released, and I'll openly welcome a bowfin into my boat any time!!

-Zach

[RLWagner]

You missed the boat bud! WE do not elect to call the bowfin a trash fish, our States DNR has classified it as such! HHHHEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Anyone home?
So I guess your opinion should carry more credibility than that of those that are paid to manage the resources? Cannot imagine too many people that would put our resources in your hands as oppossed to the management divisions.
Guess you think the Carp should be praised to as it has great fighting ability? Common Chet, need a better argument than just to bash other people and the management divisions.
I would have had some respect for you if you said "This is how I feel" instead of talking down to all who do not share your mis-guided opinions. Live and learn.

It is up to the fisherman. If you want to release it, do so, if youwant to eat it, do so, if your State allows and encourages the disposal of it, help the State and the environment out, and do so! But why attack those who do not do as you? Conceit?

[ChenBassHead]

Yes, as a matter of fact, I do believe that carp should be praised for their fighting ability...as should gar, sheepshead, etc...and this is how I feel...I didn't think I needed to say that, but I guess I'll just put that out there so it's a little more clear.  I'm not saying that your DNR is completely wrong...but to suggest that bowfin are significantly damaging the quality of fishing of a more glorified species such as bass and walleyes is questionable.  This came up last year, and I used some of the research databases that are available to me at college, and I couldn't find a single piece of evidence to even suggest that anyone has researched this at all.  You would think that in order to suggest that anglers kill these fish there would be some sort of justification...NUMBERS.  I'm not personally attacking anyone, so don't get worked up and start taking things personally. 

[fishboy]

Jim. at least you acknowledge that each person may feel a different way about this issue. You are right about the fish being great fighters, and I will attest that they dive for bottom, take long runs, and then when you think it is over, they take to the air.
And it is up to the individual to retain, release or dispose of their catch accordingly. I will also compliment you for not taking the opportunity to belittle other fisherman for their approach to less desirable fish. I could learn a lessen or two from you and your restraint as the urge to defend those of us that do not agree with the castigation of other sportsman becomes too strong to remain silent.

If others took your approach from the on-set, then there would be no need to defend , but rather to debate. Keep up the good posting.

This issue is not about "old School" as some misguided opinions may deem, but rather about stewardship based upon requests by our DNR staff and reg books. The State staff have requested from many an angler that these Trash fish be discarded period! Then the misguided argumentalists want to condemn those who follow the requests? Fishyboy, get with the times and realize that assisting the DNR with requests is an agenda, not a mentality.

RL   I am the "DNR"

Wait till the positive side of the so called "trash" fish tourneys start to take hold  big $$$ pal,  folks will change thier "misguided " tunes in a hurry when they see the amount of money anglers are willing to spend to catch Carp.  A wise man once said "we will spare no expense in pursuit of free fish"  Killing stuff cause you don't like it is simple minded and outdated and I doubt your states DNR is asking you to leave fish on the bank.  How many species do you think consume the millions of carp and sucker fry that hatch each spring?  Rough fish still serve a purpose and just because a lot of folks can't see it doesn't mean its not there.  Open your mind and look at the big picture. 

[RLWagner]

RL   I am the "DNR"

Wait till the positive side of the so called "trash" fish tourneys start to take hold  big $$$ pal,  folks will change thier "misguided " tunes in a hurry when they see the amount of money anglers are willing to spend to catch Carp.  A wise man once said "we will spare no expense in pursuit of free fish"  Killing stuff cause you don't like it is simple minded and outdated and I doubt your states DNR is asking you to leave fish on the bank.  How many species do you think consume the millions of carp and sucker fry that hatch each spring?  Rough fish still serve a purpose and just because a lot of folks can't see it doesn't mean its not there.  Open your mind and look at the big picture. 

So your saying, follow the money? What kind of justification is this? Big Government? No one said anything about killing something because we do not like it. That is your statement and attempt at portraying the "other-side" as negative. There are many benefits to discarding dogfish as many a DNR staff have pointed out in history. So for those of us that have the courage and stomach to comply, you condemn us? Then justify your opinion by the value of a dollar? If the facts on the benefits of discarding rough fish have evolved and now point in a different direction, that I can accept and adapt to, but change takes education and time. All the while people like you, chen and others jump on the opportunity to criticize those that do not prscribe to your way of thinking yet? The DNR staff that I have associated with understand the relationship between changing reg's, education and the time it takes to evolve a belief, which it appears from your post that you are immune to the steps needed to change public opinion. Look at the introduction of Wolfs, Moose and Elk as examples where it takes time and even cultural and paradigmatic shifts for a society to accept a new direction on an old belief.
You must be a Greenhorn DNR, as any vet would understand this relationship, and not criticize, but rather educate.
Is it the MONEY that has changed your mind? and your departments mind?

[fishboy]

I'll say it again

No matter what you call it. its still a Bowfin its not an exotic or introduced species.  Not invasive,   kinda cool,  fights good when caught,  but hey If you guys wanna kill stuff just cause you have no personal use for itthen go right ahead!  Then if it ever gets to the point that the species is in trouble you can B*tch that the DEC is wasting money on non-game fish.  Or better yet, wait, kill everything thats not a game, sport, or tasty panfish and when someone catches one of the relic Bowfins that remain and takes a picture of it we can have a ten page arguement on whether its legal to possess it long enough to take its picture! did it ever occur to you folks that kill stuff cause its ugly or doesn't seem to have any value, or you can't eat it that some of those species are just really cool to look at and catch ?  That "old school" mentality of hey what use is it to me? has really got to go!

Really really got to go!

[RLWagner]

I'll say it again
Really really got to go!

I think the New York Legislature is working hard on these types of issues ;DWon't be long and your entire State will be Catch and release only, and Guns will be banned as well as hunting. Your Legislature is issuing in a new way of thinking for you, and I see you two have bought into it at the drop of a dime. You should be carefull what you ask for, as you just might get it!

[OTIS]

Looks like you'll have to sneak back to your cabin and add FishBoy to the list of names in your manifesto?

[RLWagner]

Looks like you'll have to sneak back to your cabin and add FishBoy to the list of names in your manifesto?

Guess you feel a bit inconsequential eh? 

Just when things start to die down, then the ole proverbial 'Theres always one in the crowd" kind of kid pops up to stir the pot again. You all can tell who relishes in the joys of controversy. When it dies, he whips it up to a froth again! Bravo to you for having the courage to not leave well enough alone! You should be proud that you were the only one left to demonstrate your need for mud slinging. At least everyone else had the class to let it go, but not yyyooouuuu! Nice that you exposed yourself and intentions for all to read. Now be a good sport like the rest of us, and just move along, and let it be so this site can be about fishing, and not controversy that you stir up. Don't be a cancer, be a cure and go elsewhere if you want to start trouble. Do you not hear the mods right now asking that you act CIVIL with fellow sportsmen and women and children? Grow up OTIS.

[RLWagner]

Your right morale high-ground, what were we thinking!

[OTIS]

Guess you feel a bit inconsequential eh? 

Just when things start to die down, then the ole proverbial 'Theres always one in the crowd" kind of kid pops up to stir the pot again. You all can tell who relishes in the joys of controversy. When it dies, he whips it up to a froth again! Bravo to you for having the courage to not leave well enough alone! You should be proud that you were the only one left to demonstrate your need for mud slinging. At least everyone else had the class to let it go, but not yyyooouuuu! Nice that you exposed yourself and intentions for all to read. Now be a good sport like the rest of us, and just move along, and let it be so this site can be about fishing, and not controversy that you stir up. Don't be a cancer, be a cure and go elsewhere if you want to start trouble. Do you not hear the mods right now asking that you act CIVIL with fellow sportsmen and women and children? Grow up OTIS.

HAHAHA!  What a joke...

[RLWagner]

HAHAHA!  What a joke...

Sure is a crying shame that you feel that way.

[fishboy]

yeah Otis! c'mon grow up!  I'm off to stock Cougars see ya soon