2011 SALMON RIVER - SALMON AND STEELHEAD Thread

[draketrutta]

I use a big hoop net to land fish. I have recieved multipal negative comments about that from the same people that use tailing gloves and let the fish roll and bounce all over the shore for half a minute berfore they can grab

YOUR BIG HOOP NET IS POLITICALLY INCORRECT

The “In Crowd” uses “The Glove” ,

So did Michael Jackson,



I certainly hope the LFZ Glovers ain’t disturbing the smolts…
 

[dance the tides]

First the net, then the glove for the pic.  Some you dudes are much too willing to prove don't care about the resource, or show that you are better because you are  "Real Men".. As in "Real men don't wear gloves" or release fish in condition to live another day. If a steelhead survives to reproduce another generation, then we have a chance when the hatchery looses its funding. Not "IF". "WHEN".

[esox v]

First the net, then the glove for the pic.  Some you dudes are much too willing to prove don't care about the resource, or show that you are better because you are  "Real Men".. As in "Real men don't wear gloves" or release fish in condition to live another day. If a steelhead survives to reproduce another generation, then we have a chance when the hatchery looses its funding. Not "IF". "WHEN".

      The LFZ is a touchy subject. There has been many a discussion about all the floaters coming down out of there.. and how the fish are being C&R'd to death.

[esox v]

And for the record.. Fishingjason whipped my BASS fishing yesterday !!

[monic20]

this is starting to sound like a thread from SC blah blah blah !!!!!!!!! if you want to be heard go to the state of lakes meeting march 2 in oswego !    the lfz needs to be changed but in what ways i do not no what the answer is yet, but those fish need a break.

[fishingjason]

I just burned the net.

[fishingjason]

As always, it was fun fishing with you yesterday esox.

[esox v]

As always, it was fun fishing with you yesterday esox.

Yea.. the high point being me slipping off that floating ice chunk and falling in the water. Brad said he had 911 on speed dial !!    Told him I'm a floater.........

[draketrutta]

this is starting to sound like a thread from SC blah blah blah !!!!!!!!! if you want to be heard go to the state of lakes meeting march 2 in oswego !    the lfz needs to be changed but in what ways i do not no what the answer is yet, but those fish need a break.

First off, this website would have to cut the lower 20 rungs from it's ladder to reach to the depths of rattelesnake underbelly inhabitated by SC and it's founder - and taking money from members for a hat order and not delivering or even replying to their repeated requests for refunds for months. Funny how a guy that claims to be a technology communication guru can't respond when he's got other's people's money stuffed in his pocket... He could have at least aired his BS excuse of a knee surgery via his SCTV network.... Can you say L O W L I F E ?

If guys want to fish the LFZ that is their choice.

I have stood on the Rte 52 bridge looking upstream at the mayhem, and cannot for the life of me, understand why anyone would want to endure the shoulder to shoulder combat fishing. Different stokes for different folks. But if anyone thinks it is sporting to catch the same fish over & over , they are delusional;

[draketrutta]

p.s.

I tried asking a couple of Steelhead their opinions about being continously caught and released in the LFZ.

But they did not answer me,

they were too busy gulping their last breath of life as they floated belly-up under the bridge...

[bcons]

Calls for change in rules & regs MUST be handled with extreme care.  Be careful what you wish for.  While I agree the LFZ is ripped to death on busy weekends.   Often the beast you know & have is better then the one you'll get. 
Lets face it, lining fish today only takes more skill.  Before the new regs, anyone could grab a 7' broomstick with 30lb & a weighted treble & rip all day.  It's just much harder to do with a 9-15' noodle, light line, & smaller hooks, requiring much more skill.
Everyone has "snagged" fish, once you've drifted the run, or past the fish, you didn't see the 1 or 2 trailing far behind, or sitting much farther back in the tailout than you'd expect, while thinking you're just casting, Bam fish on in the tail. 
Most of the problems are the "mentality" of some, how do you regulate or legislate that?
Already the very motions required to drift a run on the fly may require you to lift or pull back a bit to avoid a known snag, then when the drift is done, casting is another "lift" (even though just casting)  arguably the same technique required to flyfish could get you a violation for lifting if you were using a spinning combo.
The debate will always rage on, fly guys sight fish too much and can snag easier than pinners, pinners take up too much room & have too much line out causing overplay on most fish,  bottom bouncing with a longer rod only gives you an even better arc through the water to potentionally snag,  spinning guys are whatever. 
Indy's won't help prevent anything, depending on shot placement, a moderate pullback, indy sinks, still have the arc through the water, it'll just be another reg those who wish to line will adapt too.   
What exactly is "Purist" river fishing anymore?  Some states outlaw ALL trout & salmon fishing in tribs & rivers since the only reason 99.9% of those fish are there is spawning, or running to & from.   I remember watching Salmon runs in the fall in NH where I grew up, they're all out of season, no fishing.
Natural habitat is the lakes, one could potentionally argue we're all interfering with that, & every method has it's potential  problems.   
Just tread carefully with calls for change, what we get, may be worse.

[fishgalore]

On top of improper picture taking and overplaying fish...I also think a proper recovery/release is important....especially in the middle of winter....From my boat I put each fish on a boga which is attached to a rope and hang the fish off the side of the boat...the fish will orient itself upstream (as my boat is at anchor) and may stay on the boga for a few minutes....sometime even longer...(the rope is long enough that they often hang out under the boat)....every couple of minutes I check them and you can tell when they are ready to swim off on their own....too many people just release them without reviving them figuring its best just to get them right back in....I don't have  a problem with people keeping fish, but like snagger said....if you catch 15 a day and either overplay it, hold it out of the water too long for a pic, or don't revive it properly...any one of those things is likely to spell doom for the fish....or at least up the odds that it won't make it...so whether it's a 1 fish limit or a 3 fish limit, if you practice improper catch and release you are doing more harm than the guy who keeps one here or there....

I think we can divide this discussion into two groups: those that care about the issue and those that don't. The ones that care are concerned about how they approach landing and releasing fish. Those that don't don't care. It's that simple or is it?
What if an angler takes all the precautions discussed that should insure that a fish survives but the fish still dies. Should he/she be viewed as someone who doesn't know what they are doing?? Or could it be that the fish was injured already, has some kind of condition, was in a weakened state before being caught, etc, etc, etc....

IMO it's really not my business what another angler does, but I do understand, sympathize and get angry when others show a callous attitude toward the resources and other anglers. Do I like the way some people drive their cars either?? No, some are rude and inconsiderate, put others in harms way by the way they drive, drive under the influence, drive under the speed limit, throw trash out their window, etc.... It's a part of every area of our life; people do wrong things.

So my point here is be careful that you don't fall into the category of over reacting. We often allow ourselves to get worked up over many things we cannot possibly control. Let the powers that be do their job and in certain circumstances we may say something. But when you do know that honey gets more than vinegar but likely will guarantee sarcasm and a disrespectful attitude when you do. You know what happens next and that can't be good either. I don't take any crap from others but I do try to treat them, at least initially, the way I want to be treated. Respect first, in your face second. This is just my 2 cents.

Here's some links about proper release practice:-

http://www.mgfalaska.com/how-to-release-fish.html

http://daveatcreekside.blogspot.com/2008/04/proper-catch-and-release-for-steehead.html

[fishgalore]

Calls for change in rules & regs MUST be handled with extreme care.  Be careful what you wish for.  While I agree the LFZ is ripped to death on busy weekends.   Often the beast you know & have is better then the one you'll get. 
Lets face it, lining fish today only takes more skill.  Before the new regs, anyone could grab a 7' broomstick with 30lb & a weighted treble & rip all day.  It's just much harder to do with a 9-15' noodle, light line, & smaller hooks, requiring much more skill.
Everyone has "snagged" fish, once you've drifted the run, or past the fish, you didn't see the 1 or 2 trailing far behind, or sitting much farther back in the tailout than you'd expect, while thinking you're just casting, Bam fish on in the tail. 
Most of the problems are the "mentality" of some, how do you regulate or legislate that?
Already the very motions required to drift a run on the fly may require you to lift or pull back a bit to avoid a known snag, then when the drift is done, casting is another "lift" (even though just casting)  arguably the same technique required to flyfish could get you a violation for lifting if you were using a spinning combo.
The debate will always rage on, fly guys sight fish too much and can snag easier than pinners, pinners take up too much room & have too much line out causing overplay on most fish,  bottom bouncing with a longer rod only gives you an even better arc through the water to potentionally snag,  spinning guys are whatever. 
Indy's won't help prevent anything, depending on shot placement, a moderate pullback, indy sinks, still have the arc through the water, it'll just be another reg those who wish to line will adapt too.   
What exactly is "Purist" river fishing anymore?  Some states outlaw ALL trout & salmon fishing in tribs & rivers since the only reason 99.9% of those fish are there is spawning, or running to & from.   I remember watching Salmon runs in the fall in NH where I grew up, they're all out of season, no fishing.
Natural habitat is the lakes, one could potentionally argue we're all interfering with that, & every method has it's potential  problems.   
Just tread carefully with calls for change, what we get, may be worse.

Good points!!

[draketrutta]

Calls for change in rules & regs MUST be handled with extreme care.  Be careful what you wish for.  While I agree the LFZ is ripped to death on busy weekends.   Often the beast you know & have is better then the one you'll get. 
Lets face it, lining fish today only takes more skill.  Before the new regs, anyone could grab a 7' broomstick with 30lb & a weighted treble & rip all day.  It's just much harder to do with a 9-15' noodle, light line, & smaller hooks, requiring much more skill.
Everyone has "snagged" fish, once you've drifted the run, or past the fish, you didn't see the 1 or 2 trailing far behind, or sitting much farther back in the tailout than you'd expect, while thinking you're just casting, Bam fish on in the tail. 
Most of the problems are the "mentality" of some, how do you regulate or legislate that?
Already the very motions required to drift a run on the fly may require you to lift or pull back a bit to avoid a known snag, then when the drift is done, casting is another "lift" (even though just casting)  arguably the same technique required to flyfish could get you a violation for lifting if you were using a spinning combo.
The debate will always rage on, fly guys sight fish too much and can snag easier than pinners, pinners take up too much room & have too much line out causing overplay on most fish,  bottom bouncing with a longer rod only gives you an even better arc through the water to potentionally snag,  spinning guys are whatever. 
Indy's won't help prevent anything, depending on shot placement, a moderate pullback, indy sinks, still have the arc through the water, it'll just be another reg those who wish to line will adapt too.   
What exactly is "Purist" river fishing anymore?  Some states outlaw ALL trout & salmon fishing in tribs & rivers since the only reason 99.9% of those fish are there is spawning, or running to & from.   I remember watching Salmon runs in the fall in NH where I grew up, they're all out of season, no fishing.
Natural habitat is the lakes, one could potentionally argue we're all interfering with that, & every method has it's potential  problems.   
Just tread carefully with calls for change, what we get, may be worse.

You make very valid points and I agree 100% with every one of them.

However, these rules do not apply to the LFZ because the fish are stacked like bowling pins and are sitting ducks with nowhere to go, and get bombarded from every conceivable direction, over & over & over.

I don’t mean to continue blasting the LFZ, but the hypocricy of the place reminds me of the BS that goes on in Washington DC everyday.  From the so-called purist fishermen that choose to chase their quarry in a fishbowl, to the DEC that manages it.

Someone previously mentioned going to the State of Lakes meeting. I would really like to hear an honest answer from the DEC if someone attended the meeting and asked them why they allow hordes of anglers to bombard the LFZ on 09-15 each year when the fish are bundled like cord wood enjoying the thermal refuge of the Cemetary Hole and other spring seeps up there..

Can you say “SHOW ME THE MONEY”???

That answer, if provided in a straight forward manner, would not bother me a bit. It is what it is..

But please don’t insult my intelligence by allowing/promoting the early season “Killing Fields of the LFZ” and on the other hand promulgate numerous other BS rules & regs on the rest of that river.

As the ole General in the Outlaw Josey Wales flick said “Don’t pizz down my back and tell me it’s rainin”.

[BAZOOKAJOE]

Theirs going to be a mortality rate in the cold months with CNR.  A lot of the fish i've seen caught were held out of the water for minutes for pics.  Who doesn't like hero shots...but either hone your camera skills or hold the fish in the water till the camera is ready.  The other day i saw this guy hold a fish out of the water for at least three minutes while his buddy took about ten pics from every angle.  And guess what...that fish floated down the river (past my feet) belly up.  I take a few pics here and there, usually when the conditions are mild.